The Raleigh Underground: A Lost Phenomenon
There was a time when Raleigh was known for its prolific music scene. With events such as the closure of King’s and the disappearance of the once thriving punk scene, it has moved from a trickle to a smattering of indie shows and some artists/groups at The Lincoln Theatre or the Performing Arts Center. The area is not completely devoid of all music, but there was a time when some of the biggest names in jazz and rock played here, in the most unlikely of locations: Cameron Village.
In the same way Cameron Village itself was modeled after a shopping plaza in Kansas City, The Village Subway was modeled after the Atlanta Underground. It was a series of restaurants, clubs, boutiques, fashion stores, and a few other shops. Some of the night clubs were The Frog & Nightgown, Cafe Deja Vu, Elliot’s Nest, The Pier, Skyline, The Bear’s Den, Midnight Express , and Soundhaus.
The entrance to Raleigh’s “Underground” was a long stairwell that was made to look like the entrance to a subway station in NYC. At the bottom of the stairs were paintings of trains to reinforce the idea. Rather than traditional wall advertisements, there were rectangular paintings of the shops that occupied the underground space. Every person I’ve spoken with that spent time there has fond and vivid recollections of that era and location. It represented a moment in time in which Raleigh was known far and wide for its nightlife and music scene. The number of talented artists that graced the halls of the underground is quite impressive. Bert from the Player’s Retreat provided me with this enormous list of some of the artists that played there:
- Doc Watson
- Eddie Money
- Huey Lewis & The News
- Steppenwolf
- Peter Tork/The Monkees
Velvet UndergroundJohn Cale (of Velvet Underground)- Nantucket
- Flock Of Seagulls
- Frank Zappa (?)
- 38 Special
- Iggy Pop
Jefferson AirplanePapa John Creach (of Jefferson Airplane)- Joan Jett
- Jimmy Buffet
David Bowie- Black Flag
- Cutting Crew
- The Ramones
- Pat Benatar
- R.E.M.
- Maynard Ferguson
- Dead Kennedys
- Sonic Youth
- Bette Midler
- Barry Mannilow
- Violent Femmes
- The Replacements
- Thelonious Monk
- Sonny Rollins
- Go-Gos
- Steve Martin
- Martin Mull
- Dizzy Gillepsie
- Roger McGuinn
- Tom Waits
- Muddy Waters
- The Bangles
- Arlo Guthrie
- Arrogance
Longtime hometown favorite The Connells played their first real gig at Deja Vu.
Leebowitz over at RDUWTF told me about a book that documents the history of Cameron Village and contains some information on the ‘Underground’. When trying to locate it, Ashlyn, a staff member at the library, told me about a performance there in which Michael Stipe from R.E.M. hid under the stage because he was so shy and/or terrified of the crowd. It seems as though anyone who lived in Raleigh when the Underground was open has some sort of recollection of this place.
According to the Cameron Village history book, there wasn’t enough foot traffic during the day and many of the shops were replaced with nightclubs and restaurants. When Boylan Pearce sold the family owned store in 1984, the Subway was shut down in the same year. With that, an era lasting twelve years ended. The area has sat idle for two decades now and is now essentially only a storage area.
A decision was made to eliminate the storage concept and to lease the Subway area to retailers who did not require prime street level space. … York’s leasing department is now discussing the remaining space with seveal other suitable prospects
- Cameron Village, A History 1949-1999
It appears the discussions on the remaining spaces have faltered, and Johnson Lambe remains the only tenant in the former Village Subway.
Sadly, as is evident from the photos, there isn’t much left other than peeling paint and a few spots of the terra cotta tiling. Nothing remains that lends itself to an almost mythical and fabled past. The stairwell (now under the library) has been covered up and paved over. The prevailing hypothesis of its untimely demise centers around liability issues. The Cameron Village history book mentioned safety concerns and drug use supposedly prevalent at the time as the reasons for its closure. Several of the businesses in operation were doing quite well when the lights were turned off for the last time.
The Village Subway is not an almost forgotten relic in the minds of those who lived here at the time. RDUWTF published the original floor plan last August, and there is a myspace page dedicated to The Pier.
Will this dead zone continue to be a wasted expanse and used for nothing more than storage? Will Raleigh ever regain the aura of music mecca of the triangle? Will the new found riches and glitz suddenly pouring in to Raleigh from all directions do anything to revive the lost cultural past of the Village Subway?
As much as I’d love to hope so, I don’t see it happening any time soon.
Do you remember the Underground? Let us know what you saw or experienced.
UPDATE (07.11.08): In double checking my notes, David Bowie was not on the list. It must have been wishful thinking. I added the other acts at the end of the list as provided by readers.
I’d like to point out that all inaccuracies of the bands (left on but marked through) that played here were all errors on my part and not of Bert’s.
I was only born in 1976, but growing up in Cameron Park I remember the Stairwell out in front of where the library is now, and the entrance by where the Burger King was at the other end. Being a kid, my parents didn’t bring me down there, prbably for good reason, as it was mostly nightlife. It was really interesting to see the pictures. Thanks for posting them!
Comment by greg — July 8, 2008 @ 6:04 am
Oh my God, how do I get in there?!? That is a photographer’s paradise down there, and I’d love to do some model shoots down there.
Comment by viridari — July 8, 2008 @ 6:26 am
Great post. I went to the Subway at least once a week in the early 1980s. In addition to the nightclubs there was a really good videogame arcade there too. I’m pretty sure that Soundhaus was a stereo equipment store, not a nightclub. And I would take some of the names on that list you got from Bert with a grain of salt–no way did the Velvet Underground ever play down there. How did you get in to the space? I asked at Johnson-Lambe a while back, and they wouldn’t let me in there (even with my fine laminated RDUWTF credentials) and they said that “nothing” was left–I don’t consider those wonderful peeling murals to be “nothing.” There is no such thing as the good old days, but Cameron Village of 1983 (with a movie theater, with stores that catered to all social classes, with nightclubs that attracted national acts) beats Cameron Village of now, hands down.
Comment by A Loud Arcane Toad — July 8, 2008 @ 7:37 am
Velvet Underground? That seems unlikely to me, as does David Bowie. I will add Dead Kennedys, MDC, Joan Jett,, X, Sonic Youth and SWANS to the list of bands that performed at the Pier.
There was a fire in Underground Atlanta at some point and fear of that liability, mixed with the clientele attracted by video arcades and live music venues, was the undoing of The Village Subway. Cameron Village security wasn’t keen on the crowd attracted by Black Flag and Dead Kennedys fans - they didn’t mesh well with the retail environment.
Great post. Thanks for the great photos!
Comment by Robert E Leebowitz — July 8, 2008 @ 7:39 am
What an awesome post. Thanks for this great bit of history. I’ve been in the Raleigh area for about 17 years now but had no idea that this place ever existed. The photos of this old rundown space really help to paint a picture of what things might have been like. It would be amazing to see such a scene form in the Raleigh area again. Where do we sign up?!?
Comment by kitch — July 8, 2008 @ 12:26 pm
I remember the Frog and Nightgown and the Pier very well. Both had great acts from New York nightclubs, jazz and popular. I remember fondly attending a couple of shows at the Frog and Nightgown for a little known Bette Midler and her unknown pianist, Barry Manilow. Those were great times.
Comment by Horatio — July 8, 2008 @ 12:30 pm
I used to go down there and played in the Cafe Deja Vu a few times — it was a happening place. FWIW, Soundhaus was a high end audio shop and not a music club.
thanks for the reminder. nice pics. i love your blog. I’m a PR regular, so I’ll probably run into you some day there doing “research” with Bert.
Comment by eg — July 8, 2008 @ 2:50 pm
I definitely remember it, except nobody used the term “Underground”. Everyone called it The Subway or The Village Subway. I liked Battlestations, the tucked away closet with about 15 video games.
Comment by Dana — July 8, 2008 @ 3:10 pm
Those where the days! I saw The Replacements open for Violent Femmes at the Pier back in (I think) 1983. Saw Dead Kennedys also. If I’m not mistaken Sonic Youth’s Confusion Is Sex album has a live version of “I Wanna Be Your Dog” which was recorded at the Pier.
Comment by Richardfoc — July 8, 2008 @ 3:47 pm
Awesome post! Are those recent pictures? I’d long assumed that the space had been taken over for storage, etc
Comment by chris — July 8, 2008 @ 6:39 pm
That’s funny, I remember when they built that place. I played at the Frog, with bands at Deju Vu and the Pier, and never heard of some of these people listed as playing there.
Jefferson Airplane was well-broken up by that time. Who came up with that ? About the same for Zappa - when in heck did he ever play there.
Nice article overall, but some serious fact-checking is in order here !
Comment by dave — July 9, 2008 @ 11:45 am
I went down there via the side door just past Johnson-Lambe back in 2000. They said, “go ahead, not much to see”, but to me it was very moving to be down there again. I saw bands down there at the various clubs from about ‘79 - ‘84. I went back in 2004 or so, but this time, I didn’t ask permission, I just walked in via the same door. That’s probably not recommended, but I did anyway. It looked pretty much 8 years ago and four years ago as the photos on this page. Thanks so much for documenting this. I didn’t have a camera either time I went.
Comment by Jeff Hart — July 9, 2008 @ 4:03 pm
eg - Thanks, and I hope to bump in to you at the PR some time.
Dana - I have no first hand knowledge of what people may have called it at the time, but three of the four people I spoke with prior to writing this article referred to it as ‘The Underground’ and not ‘The Village Subway’.
Chris - the photos are recent. there is a large swath of space still being used for storage.
Dave - You are correct, they broke up shortly before the place opened. What should be there instead of Jefferson Airplane is Papa John Creach, from Jefferson Airplane. This was an error on my part and not from Bert’s. I’ll correct it. As far as Frank Zappa, I don’t see Raleigh on this gig list, but it isn’t billed as complete. With regard to fact checking, there are very few resources available that display tours and dates of the late 70s to early 80s. Corrections, additions, and removals have been made based on reader feedback. Thank you for the correction.
Jeff - I’m glad the photos in the article had a positive impact.
I’d like to thank everyone else for the additions to the list. As mentioned, there are few resources on the internet that document the history of this place and I’m glad now there can at least be an unofficial list.
Comment by John — July 9, 2008 @ 5:46 pm
You can add Thelonious Monk and Sonny Rollins to that list. They both played The Frog and Nightgown. By the way, Raleigh was more than just the home of punk and indie rock. The jazz scene in Raleigh has been on the map for a good 60 years at least, and Raleigh was always a stop on the “chitlin’ circuit” in the 50’s and 60’s by Motown, Stax, and jazz artisits alike.
Comment by Chico — July 9, 2008 @ 8:49 pm
you could also include the go-gos, x, steve martin, martin mull, dizzy gillepsie, roger mcguinn, jimmy buffet, tom waits, muddy waters, and the bangles. as far as velvet underground, i do know john cale played. as for zappa-it could’ve been a “secret show” but have never heard of that. what i do know is that the rolling stones wanted to do a secret show at the pier during the tattoo you tour .the land owner s of the subway wouldn’t allow for the removal of a wall so the stones could get out without being mobbed-my father and others were ready with the sledgehammers that day. it’s great to see the pictures-last time i was down there was early 85. me and my father snuck in through the back at the dumpster/loading dock area.
btw-i’m the one w/ the pier myspace page-my folks ran that place until its closing in ‘84. i’ve been slack on the myspace lately but will upload more ephemera soon. goddamn i miss that place-i grew up down there.
Comment by sean — July 10, 2008 @ 2:01 pm
Man - what memories! Add David Allen Coe, Chic Corea, Arlo Guthrie as well as local bands like Glass Moon and Lariet Sam. I remember (I think I remember) Wednesday nights at the Deja Vu was bluegrass night - hippies, rednecks, rock and rollers and even a few Hells Angels would all mix tgether to hear Roby Huffman and the Bluegrass Cutups! Mondays were Rock and Roll night at the Frog and Nightdown, showcasinfg local bands. Man, I’d like to get back in thee just to feel the vibe!!!
Comment by DaBrain — July 10, 2008 @ 9:09 pm
wow. This is just awesome. I would have never known so many of these artists once played here. I never even knew any of the history of Cameron Village before frequenting RDUWTF- which led me here.
Great blog!
Thanks!
Comment by packpigskinfan25 — July 10, 2008 @ 9:45 pm
A friend told me about seeing Cold Chisel at the Pier. One of the only times they ever toured in America. If anyone knows who them, I will be shocked.
Comment by TimO — July 11, 2008 @ 7:07 am
In the early eighties I remember going to Cafe Deja Vu two or three times to see the Pressure Boys. Being underage I felt fortunate to have friends in the opening bands to help get me in. My trips there were quite a big deal to me at that age. Thanks for posting this page.
Seems like someone told me they saw the Sex Pistols at the Pier. Is that correct? Anyone remember that?
Comment by Jeff Carroll — July 11, 2008 @ 3:14 pm
I frequented the area from mid 1982 until it closed. There was Soundhaus a stereo store, The Peir which had national acts and the biggest local bands, mostly original music such as The Fabulous Knobs, The Snap, X-teens, Rick Rock and others. I saw The Lords Of the New Church there, Chris Stamey> that I remember. And many others. I believe the Bad Brains played. I know a version of Stepenwolf played. The scene was happening. I believe I was at the the Cafe deja Vu when the Connells opened for someone and where mostly instrumental-maybe the first show. They may have opened for Johnny Quest. The Deja Vu had smaller bands and some rhythm-n blues. One of my favorites was Jimmy and the Jones and the alter ego Subliminal Surge-great. Another band of the time was Export A from Durham which later became Safehouse-Sonar & Terry McInturf. There was another bar there that was mainly just a bar. There was the Bear’s Den. They had some cover bands and a mixture- Mostly Rock. I did see Stever Morse of the then broken up Dixie Dregs play with Raleigh’s Jerry Peek and Doug Morgan from the great fusion band 3PM. I believe the x-teens opened. I saw Bryce Street there. There was Battlestations the arcade. It was FUN. There was an entrance from the Parking lot on the Library side and an entrance on the side of Woodburn next to where the Mandarin House was. I always knew of it as the Cameron Village Subway or the Subway. I never heard of it called the Underground. As I remember The Pier close first, later to reopen in Mision Valley for a short time, Then The Bears Den moved and lasted only briefly. The Deja Vu kept going for a little while after that. The seperations and the beginnings of local Punk and original music bands along with the New Wave style that was taking shape led to it dying. By this time The Culture Club on Morgan St. had opened and was taking alot of business away with original local bands and traveling national acts that weren’t that big yet. Also PC Goodtimes was letting punk bands and local original bands play- That later became the Brewery.
Comment by bill — July 11, 2008 @ 3:16 pm
Man! Somebody else remembers the Culture Club! That sure was a happening and energetic, but short-lived hotspot. As far as the Subway or Underground, when it first opened in 1968 or 69 with all the shoppees and bow-ti-kews it was always the Village Subway. By the time it was turning into a Rock venue in the mid 70s everybody was refering to it as the underground, as in hey man, who’s playing at the underground this weekend? At least in my crowd anyway. Great post John. Awesome photos, as always. Don’t see to many of your interior shots.
Comment by Karl — July 11, 2008 @ 3:57 pm
The list of people who MIGHT have played at the Underground is amazing. I think most of Bette and Barry’s gigs were at the old Frog & Nightgown on Medlin Drive - but Stan Getz crammed his big band in there in 1971-2. My rock solid memories: David Bromberg performing and sitting at the bar on break, being incredibly gracious with his conversations, Tom Waits growling out some of his classics, and Laura Nyro being sold out or a no-show - can’t remember which, just the disappointment. Cafe Deja Vu was the highlight of Raleigh’s 70’s culture - my best memory being listening to Chip Crawford bang out his jazz version of “I shot the Sherriff.” Great spots, great post and comments.
Comment by John Dancy-Jones — July 12, 2008 @ 9:46 am
I too have fond memories of partying at the Underground. I want to add that I saw Oscar Peterson at a jazz brunch at Cafe Deja Vu and Asleep at the Wheel at the Pier. I actually danced on the table in front of Ray Benson. Yee Haa!!!
I also remember a band that played at Deja Vu regularly - Dr. Groove. Some of those guys are still around Raleigh. I hope they find this website.
Comment by pathall — July 14, 2008 @ 5:57 pm
OOO - forgot. Taj Mahal also played the Pier.
Comment by pathall — July 14, 2008 @ 5:59 pm
We should bring it back, sounds awesome. I like the new layout John and those pictures rock as always. We should go down there sometime.
Comment by walden — July 15, 2008 @ 9:01 pm
Great memories and enjoyed reading them all. There’s a lot of history at Cameron Village and we need to protect what’s left. Are any of you aware of the 9 story apartment building proposed for the corner of Clark and Oberlin where the old Balantines used to be? Read up and get involved. I’m forming a webstie “Save Our Village” and should have it up by next week. Your comments will be welcome.
Comment by Emily — July 18, 2008 @ 1:09 pm
Wow. Thanks for the post! I invited my boyfriend (now hubby!) on our first date to see Leon Redbone play down there (maybe at the Pier? Not sure which venue now) in 1980 or ‘81.
Had wondered what had happened to the place ….
Comment by Pam — July 18, 2008 @ 11:33 pm
I saw Proctor and Bergman (of The Firesign Theatre) at the Pier in the late seventies.
Comment by frank — July 18, 2008 @ 11:51 pm
The Pier that moved to Mission Valley was not associated with the Pier in Cameron Village. The mission valley version offered to buy the name but the offer was refused. The mission valley version used the name anyhow, and advertised on the radio as being the Pier from cameron village. Thus is why the one in Mission Valley did not last very long.
Comment by sean — July 21, 2008 @ 2:54 pm
I remember driving over from UNC to see Jimmy Buffett at least a couple of times - maybe at The Pier. It was just him and one other guy the first time, and I think he had a couple female backup singers the other time. I sure wish I could remember when it was other than “sometime between 1974-77.”
Comment by Martha — July 31, 2008 @ 9:45 am
Would anyone know someone who could actually pay the freight required to bring back the Underground? If there’s anyone out there in the music business that may have the resources to do this, let’s contact them then get together and make it happen. I’m sure the current owners are in the business to make money and have an open mind about bringing back some Raleigh history. If anyone is seriously interested in investing in the Underground at Cameron Village, let them come forward. Any ideas?
Comment by Enigma — August 4, 2008 @ 8:14 pm
Enigma - I’ve talked with the current owners, and can confirm that they are interested in doing something with that space that has sat idle for so long. The space has been inspected and they are confident that it can be brought up to code and the egress and ingress can be worked out. The challenge is that in order to invest the necessary resources to do this, there has to be willing tenants who will come to the table.
The first thing that comes to my mind is King’s Barcade, but I have no idea if the former owners would even be remotely interested in such a venture. It also remains to be seen if the current owners are interested in any sort of traffic in that space that isn’t what Cameron Village has traditionally been associated with for the past 20 years.
I would think the history of that place alone would be enough collateral to bring forward potential tenants. Giiven the fact that the music scene of this area is especially thin with the relative age of the population and incredibly high growth rate, it seems like it would be a great opportunity for someone to take the risk.
Comment by John — August 5, 2008 @ 12:12 am
I went on my first date with Peter Eichenberger he took me to see Tom Waits
a couple of years later i took our son David to see Iggy Pop. Iggy walked by with his friend both wearing a skirt no one believed me that it was him. i said no woman is that ugly!!
i was always a regular at Deja Vu where i hung out with Louise (i really do miss her) we would always have a good time i would clean the tables to get in for free !! and crash the after parties!
I always listened to Steve Runkle i think they called them selves the pearls at that time . (I miss steve too,i heard a peter green song the other day and i thought steve had sung it !!)
i will always be the subway groupy!! im glad i was able to be the right age to be there !!
Comment by sandy smith — August 5, 2008 @ 12:02 pm
The Pier , DeJaVu, Frog and Nightgown were home of some very special nights of great entertainment. I worked at the Pier (if you could call it work) and we were privileged to have so many great bands play all during the week. I remember Jimmy Buffett, Joan Jett, Huey Lewis, David Alan Coe, Warren Zevon, Truckers, 2 B’s Please, JJ Cale, Muddy Waters to name a few. We also loved having the local bands play like Tumbleweed, Lariat Sam, Super Grit, Glass Moon and Mike Cross. Seems like pitchers of beer were less than $3.00 and you could brown bag since we did not have mixed drinks. It’s a great joy to see this site that brings back so many great memories. We had a Pier Reunion 14 years ago. Wouldn’t it be great to have a Village Subway Reunion?
Deby1010@nc.rr.com
Comment by Debby Boyles Boozer — August 5, 2008 @ 12:40 pm
Add Stiv Bators, of the Dead Boys and Lords of the New Church, to the list of acts/artists who have performed at The Pier. I also remember attending a debut party of the Police album “Ghost in the Machine” at The Pier, where they played the whole thing.
BattleStations was great! I still have an arcade token from there. The whole Subway was a great place go to.
I doubt it would work again. The whole “scene” just isn’t right. The whole atmosphere in Raleigh was lost in the early 80s, and just hasn’t been the same since. Hillsborough Street, Franklin Street, the Subway– none of these will probably ever be like the “glory days” they once were. As a society, we really have forgotten how to have fun.
Comment by htomc42 — September 5, 2008 @ 7:46 pm
This isn’t “music”, but I know that Lily Tomlin did a comedy gig at the Frog & Nightgown one weekend in 1974; I was in 5th grade and my mother took me and a friend to the Sunday afternoon show, but she had not thought to get advance tickets and it was sold out. I remember being able to see a blurred image of her through thin yellow plastic “windows” and hear her, but not get in.
As for fact-checking what acts player there–it’s a task, but just get microfilm of old News & Observers and look through the entertainment pages. Just grab a reel and page through a week at a time, and you’ll find not only the acts, but the dates. That’s a task that could very easily be delegated out to a crew of dedicated folks with an interest in local history.
Comment by Bootes — September 6, 2008 @ 2:48 pm
Add Robin Trower to that list…late summer/early fall of 1984 at The Pier. Was working for Northern Telecom @ RTP & went to that show with some co-workers. Outstanding show, to say the least.
Comment by madczech — September 19, 2008 @ 4:34 pm
I hadn’t heard about this before… too bad I missed it! Sounds AMAZING.
Comment by Stacy — October 1, 2008 @ 6:48 pm